Trying to figure out how to set a shift + Hold in the radial menus

Questions and answers about 3Dconnexion devices on Windows.

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jwick
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Re: Trying to figure out how to set a shift + Hold in the radial menus

Post by jwick » Fri Mar 02, 2018 4:31 am

You can't have the press and release on two different device buttons.

If you assign them in a RadialMenu they will work. Of course they work on a single button -- the professional devices have "dedicated keys". When the device button is released the key is released. This is what single key macros do (KeyStrokes).

The long-press buttons (e.g., the LCD keys on a SpaceMouse Enterprise) won't work because they don't distinguish between the press and release of the non-long press usage. It would be sort of interesting to have the short-press do a Shift-Press and a long-press of that button do the Shift-Release. That would give you your Shift-Lock toggle. But it would only be for the professional products.

I'll look into it for a future release.

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Re: Trying to figure out how to set a shift + Hold in the radial menus

Post by mhoopes » Fri Mar 02, 2018 10:12 am

Ok, I believe I understand. My other options for release are acceptable, at any rate (KeyStroke or app switch).

My preferred option would be for two of the dedicated buttons (Shift, Ctrl) to have a toggle hold option, as you had suggested earlier. I found that holding those buttons down hampers (or increases effort for) usage of the 6-axis knob. The most common usage for those buttons, in my case, is for multiple selection functions.
Michael Hoopes

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Re: Trying to figure out how to set a shift + Hold in the radial menus

Post by jwick » Mon Mar 05, 2018 3:22 am

I added two such functions to the next release for you (Shift Lock, Ctrl Lock).

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Re: Trying to figure out how to set a shift + Hold in the radial menus

Post by vertigo262 » Sun Mar 11, 2018 4:30 am

Thank you Jwick

I moded the xml files and that worked. But a built in feature is a much better Idea. The ability to customize locking keys would be a good idea for your software

Or at least to create them in the Macro section

Once again, very helpful, thank you

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Re: Trying to figure out how to set a shift + Hold in the radial menus

Post by mhoopes » Fri Mar 23, 2018 2:04 pm

jwick wrote:
Mon Mar 05, 2018 3:22 am
I added two such functions to the next release for you (Shift Lock, Ctrl Lock).
jwick - I just tried out the new Shift Lock and Ctrl Lock keyboard functions. They work well- thanks much! That was a quick addition. Also, the Hint typo in AltiumDesigner.xml is gone. I posted about that on the Altium user forum.
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Re: Trying to figure out how to set a shift + Hold in the radial menus

Post by mhoopes » Tue Mar 27, 2018 7:54 am

Here are some recent observations concerning the new Shift Lock and Ctrl Lock keyboard functions, limited to testing in the applications listed below. In all cases, I mapped Shift Lock and Ctrl Lock to the respective Shift and Ctrl buttons on my SpaceMouse Pro.

1. I can initiate them in the following applications: Altium Designer, Google Chrome, MS Excel 2016, MS OneNote 2016, MS PowerPoint 2016, MS Word 2016, Windows 7 Calculator, Windows Explorer, Adobe Acrobat Reader DC, and CorelDRAW X3.
2. I cannot initiate them in the following applications: Creo Parametric (Part and Assembly modes, so far), Notepad++ x64. I haven't checked the log to see what's getting sent.
3. When I can initiate them, they lock Shift and/or Ctrl in all applications (still active when changing focus to another application).
4. Hitting Shift/Ctrl on my keyboard, or Shift Lock/Ctrl Lock on the SpaceMouse Pro, in any application, will unlock that respective modifier. I think that is ok.
5. In Notepad++, after I map Shift Lock and Ctrl Lock to Shift and Ctrl, respectively, re-opening 3DxSmartUI indicates they are still mapped to Shift and Ctrl. %userprofile%\AppData\Roaming\3Dconnexion\3DxWare\Cfg\notepad++ indicates that HIDButton_25 and HIDButton_26 are mapped to Driver_CtrlLock and Driver_ShiftLock, respectively. However, the locking is not working there.
6. In Creo Parametric 2.0 (M250), the situation is similar to Notepad++, except that 3DxSmartUI agrees with the roaming profile.
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Re: Trying to figure out how to set a shift + Hold in the radial menus

Post by jwick » Wed Apr 18, 2018 4:08 am

Hi Michael,

Where are you setting the keys to the *Lock ButtonAssignments? If in Global, then there are definitely some inconsistencies especially with what is shown in the GUI. If in the application cfg, it seems to work for me, but it can be confusing because there are many modes in an application like Creo. Each mode would need the button assigned. The log file tells what is going on. The GUI is often incorrect when settings are made in Global.

Editing global.xml is not supported by the GUI. It is skiing off the trail. If more people want to use it, we will have to address them.

Some of the applications (notepad++, Creo) don't seem to do anything with one of the modifiers, regardless of whether I hold down the keyboard physical button or use the Shift/Ctrl_Lock function.

I am not sure how I feel about the fact that Shift/Ctrl_Locks are not released between app switches. With a real keyboard they are not released. That seems more predictable than a key suddenly being released just because you switched applications. OTOH, that is the way our software traditionally works. E.g., if you hold down the SME's Ctrl key (pre-lock version), it will be released when you switch applications. I suppose I need to choose one behavior or the other. But I would like to get feedback from users before making a decision.

Jim

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Re: Trying to figure out how to set a shift + Hold in the radial menus

Post by mhoopes » Wed Apr 18, 2018 7:14 am

Hello Jim-

[jwick: Where are you setting the keys to the *Lock ButtonAssignments?...] In the case of the new Shift/Ctrl_Lock functions, I'm only doing it through 3DxSmartUI. Creo Parametric and Notepad++ are the two applications that I'm having problems with. Notepad++ doesn't really need those functions, since CapsLock exists, but Creo Parametric is the app in which I'd use it the most.

I'm avoiding editing any of the core profiles, and definitely don't have enough expertise to be comfortable modifying global.xml.

[jwick: I am not sure how I feel about the fact that Shift/Ctrl_Locks are not released between app switches...] I suppose there are tradeoffs for any particular approach. I tend to favor the one that is most consistent with the rest of the UI/UX. In the specific case of Shift/Ctrl_Lock, there's not enough precedent to give me a strong bias. That said, I think I would favor them releasing on app switch. I'm finding that it's easy to forget that they're locked.

It could automatically restore lock when returning the app that the lock was initiated in, but the use case for that is pretty limited. Normally, holding Shift or Ctrl is part of a sequence of selecting objects, then executing an operation or applying a global change to those objects; one wouldn't switch to another app in the middle of that sequence.
Michael Hoopes

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Re: Trying to figure out how to set a shift + Hold in the radial menus

Post by Intuos » Fri Jun 22, 2018 8:29 am

Not to hijack this topic, but I think that an addition to shift and control lock where essentially any modifier could be locked and unlocked with a specific key would be nice. There could be an option like a macro where one can set which modifier to lock and which key unlocks the modifier. This is for commands which require a key to commit to a certain action. In CAD I can think of control to do multiple selections after which you may press enter to commit to a certain tool, once enter is pressed, control would be unlocked by pressing enter, as the action is completed. Or in 3ds Max/ Photoshop/ Mudbox where changing brush size is done with a modifier + keypress/right mouse click, in which case the latter unlocks the prior.

In short an unlock input button in the UI where the user inputs which key/ mouse button unlocks the modifier (roughly similar to the macro creation box). This allows for one handed input and mitigates the need to toggle a modifier lock off every so often.

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